Molag Bal, Lorkhan and CHIM

This is my theory on how Molag Bal came to be, and why Molag Bal was the one to tell Vivec about CHIM.

First, lets look at what the name Molag Bal means. It comes with two parts. The second is most important. Bal.

There is a god in real life called Baal, or Ba'al, whose name holds several meanings. The most well known is "Lord" and "Master" (Molag Bal is the ultimate slavemaster). Another meaning for it is "to take ownership of" and "consummate".

Right here, take ownership of is obviously related to Molag Bal, because he dominates and enslaves. The second part is consummate. Seems unrelated, except that we remember that Vivec had to marry Molag Bal and consummate with him. So what, right? Well, lets look at CHIM, and why Molag Bal might have been the one to tell Vivec about it.

CHIM is as we know, the end result of knowing that the world is a dream, you are the dream, but you still are you. This process of CHIM we know however, is not the final destination. The final destination is Amaranth. And to become the Amaranth is to become the new Godhead and make dreams of your own.

One other individual who achieved CHIM was Talos, who as we know, mantled Lorkhan before he achieved CHIM. Mantling, CHIM, and Amaranth. All the process of dominating someone else and becoming them.

Consummate has similar spelling to the word consume. Consume is pretty much the ultimate form of rape, isn't it? When you eat someone or something, you are literally making it a part of you, as our cells are composed of material from what we eat. Mantling is like consuming someone's identity, and literally becoming them. Or them, becoming you.

I believe that Molag Bal became who he was when Lorkhan looked to the wheel sideways and saw God's name, and the possibility of CHIM. Because Lorkhan tricked (supposedly) the gods, making them all become a part of Nirn, and birthing Mundus. In a way, Lorkhan raped them. And when his heart was ripped out by Trinimac, then shot into Nirn by Auriel, like a sperm to seed, in a way, Auriel raped him back by giving his divine spark forcibly to Nirn who in a way is a deity in her own right.

Molag Bal observed this, watched the gods forcibly become chained to Nirn and forcibly made to create it, and he took on the theme of slave lord, king of domination and rape, because he saw Lorkhan's plot. His plot to rape Godhead through mantling, CHIM, and Amaranth. Talos's statue does look like he's dominating a snake (Lorkhan) yes? And, as we saw in C0da, Lorkhan literally has Akatosh within him, as they are one. Time and Space, and Lorkhan toppled Akatosh's place in the mythic, which is what the enantiomorph is. Recreating symbolically Lorkhan's rise over him and becoming the new king. Dominating him. And enantiomorph is one means of mantling, which is necessary for Amaranth.

So it makes sense that the King of Rape would know about CHIM.

Supporting evidence goes back to the god Baal, which sounds like Bal. He was in real life mythology, the son of Dagon, and god of the sun, a fertility god, who was closely related to another god named Moloch, which brings me to the second word of Molag Bal. Molag. Moloch, also known as Molekh.... Molekh was also a lord of the sun, and Molekh as well as Baal are sometimes said to look like Bulls with great horns:

http://cache.g4tv.com/ImageDb3/298140_S/molag-bal.jpg

http://img.4plebs.org/boards/x/image/1367/46/1367466959552.jpg

And the people would sacrifice innocent people and children to Molekh's statue:

"The statue was hollow, and inside there burned a fire which colored the Moloch a glowing red. Children were placed on the hands of the statue. Through an ingenious system the hands were raised to the mouth (as if Moloch were eating) and the children fell into the fire where they were consumed by the flames." -On Moloch

http://www.pantheon.org/articles/m/moloch.html

So here, we see this concept of consumption again. The sacrifices are given to the god Molekh in order to strengthen the sun, becoming a part of his power. He takes ownership of them. They become him. And part of the meaning of the name Baal is to take ownership of/and consummate. Consume. Enter, the concept of, Molag Bal.

Now, Molag Bal, lord of Cold Harbour is pretty much the exact opposite of a sun god, right? Except, it is stated that the Aldmeri meaning for Molag Bal is "Fire Stone":

"The statue was hollow, and inside there burned a fire which colored the Moloch a glowing red."

This last part might be a stretch, but if you look at the name Molokh and Moloch, it sounds similar to Malacath, and as we know, Malacath, or Malak and Malauch, was consumed then dung birthed by Boethia. There's that theme of consuming again. You could say Boethia ultimately raped Trinimac even. Not saying there's a connection between Malacath and Molag Bal (though who knows), but Malacath's origins represent this theme Molag Bal has in this theory, and the real life Molekh, or Moloch supports this idea in his consumption of sacrifices.

So there's the theory and the support. Molag Bal knows about CHIM, because CHIM is one step in Lorkhan's plot for Godhead to be ultimately raped, consumed, dominated and taken over. And Molag Bal took on this idea fully, embracing it in its entirety. Perhaps that is why he is so consumed with the thought of taking over Nirn? And corrupting the mortals there. If Nirn became Coldharbour, that would mean Molag Bal literally mantled it, consumed it. Because Molag Bal is Coldharbour, his plane. He wants to rape Nirn.

So really, who better than Molag Bal to tell Vivec about CHIM?

And if you think the connection between he and Lorkhan is a stretch, remember that Sheogorath was created when Lorkhan's heart was ripped out, and Jyggalag, prince of total order and stasis, could no longer exist truly in a world where total order no longer existed, thanks to Lorkhan's chaotic world anchored by his own heart.

Before a book told us this was when Sheogorath was born, I'd have called that a huge stretch as well. [;)]

Also, Molag Bal's theme of rape also includes consumption, when you look at his vampires. They "consummate" your union with Molag Bal through a bite, sticking their fangs in your flesh. Some drinking blood, some eating flesh, some even said to swallow men whole. Supposedly.

Consumption is the ultimate form of rape. Mantling is the ultimate act of rape. Consume mate. Consummate.

Conversation between me and Malak the Orc from BSF:

Me: Could you give me your thoughts on this thread? I've read your theories in the past on Trinimac and the gods associated with him, and the recent one about Stuhn and Tsun. Can't believe so many of us missed the connection from Shor son of Shor, so awesome job [:)] Anyway, I figured you'd be the guy to show this to because you're great with seeing hidden connections

Malak the Orc:

[quote] Hmm... Interesting thread. I'll admit, I'm not well-versed in the various Walking Ways. But, after seeing some of the points Colonel/Baldur brought up, I can definitely see a connection between Bal's sphere of influence and two of the Walking Ways.

To start, there is mantling, which is pretty much forcing reality to make no distinction between you and the one you are mantling/enveloping. Walk like them until they MUST walk like you. Fits nicely with Molag Bal's sphere of domination.

The other Walking Way that comes to mind is Eat-It-To-Become-It, which is said to be what Boethiah did to Trinimac. Obviously, this is the act of consumption, which falls in line with what Baldur is saying about consummation/consumption. Just like mantling, it is forcing another to become as one with you, which, again, fits nicely with Bal's dominating sphere. It's pretty much identity [censored], as Baldur put it. "Reach heaven by violence" and all that jazz.

As for Molag Bal's creation, I think it's worth mentioning that according to "The Myth of Aurbis," the Daedra were created at the time the Aedra died. It seems to contradict what we know, what with the et'Ada attaining their identities from the birth of the Time Dragon and whatnot. What it most likely means, is that the Daedra probably realized their spheres within the Wheel. The idea that Molag Bal realized his sphere as a result of the Aedra becoming slaves to the Mundus makes perfect sense.

The connection between Molag Bal and Mauloch is rather interesting. For one, both gods are the primary rivals of Boethiah. There's also the fact that both of them are symbolized by the mace, with Bal's artifact being his eponymous mace and Malacath's artifact being Scourge. I hadn't really given much thought to their connections with Moloch before. It's interesting to note that Moloch and Mithras share a lot similarities in symbology. Both are gods of fire and the sun, and both possess strong bull symbolism. And since we're on the subject of fire and the sun, I'd like to bring up the fact that one of Molag Bal's monikers is "Lion of the Evening". The lion is almost always a symbol of fire and the sun, especially in Mithraism. It is also a symbol of royalty, which is exactly what CHIM means: royalty.

I can't remember who it was that first thought of the idea, but there was some talk a little while ago about each of the Four Corners teaching CHIM to mortals. Molag Bal with Vivec, Dagon with Mankar Camoran, Sheogorath with the Champion of Cyrodiil (this one is weak), and Malacath with Chevalier Renald. That last one is based on the theory that Trinimac/Malacath was the pig tutor of Renald, and Renald is speculated to be Zurin Arctus. Assuming this theory is true, that would mean both Bal and Malacath's "students" were the only successful CHIMsters in history.

That's all I can think of right now. I'll update you if I have anything else to share. [/quote]

Me: Oh sorry, I forgot to mention that was me [:lol:] Thanks a lot, I'll analyze this some in the morning more. My main goal was to see if it had much credibility.

edit:

K, actually I just analyzed it now, because [censored] sleeping, that's why [:lol:] Honestly, all I can really say is that I love all of this, and that you brought up some connections I hadn't thought of, which is exactly what I was seeking. Mind if I post this with your name on it in the Imperial Library thread?

And I remember saying a while ago to people that it didn't make sense for spirits to have these "themes" if you will, without context. How can one be the daedric prince of plots and murder, if you cannot murder? IE, without mortals to observe. Which is another interesting connection, the one of Mephala to Lorkhan. Supposedly The Night Mother and Sithis. She must have been impressed with what she saw the day Mundus was born, if that connection is true. After all, Lorkhan pulled off the ultimate scheme of strife, deception and murder from the elven creation myth point of view.

Malak the Orc:

[quote] Oh, snap. I had no idea you changed your username. LOL Sorry bout that, Colonel.

But yeah, feel free to mention any of these points. I'll try to think of some more, if I can.

On the Daedra being created at the beginning of the Merethic, I've always wondered why they never took part in the war of the Dawn. Nirn was still chaotic at that point, and it didn't have any of its barriers fully in place yet. So I'm not really sure why they just sat on the sidelines. Maybe "The Myth of Aurbis" is right, and the Daedra had not fully realized themselves yet and could only do so with the deaths of the Aedra. [/quote]

http://www.imperial-library.info/content/molag-bal-lorkhan-and-chim